Saturday - June 24, 2017
Home    About    Writers    Links    Contact     RSS

About the Author

Bobby McMahon

Bobby McMahon

You can see me on Soccer Central most Mondays and Thursdays on Rogers Sportsnet in Canada. I write a regular column for and and frequently guest on various podcasts and radio shows.


Rangers and Celtic Envious of FA Cup Domination?

Written by on January 27, 2011 | 1 Comment »
Posted in Cup Competitions

A few weeks ago XFM London 104.9 got me riled when they reported on the draw for the 5th round of the Scottish Cup. They noted that when Rangers and Celtic were paired together that “usually the two teams meet in the final rather than the early stages.”

A quick review of Scottish Cup Finalists over the last 18 seasons showed that the Old Firm had only met in the Scottish Cup Final twice in that time. (On further review it has actually only happened three times since 1980.)

Much more common is the two sides facing each other in the earlier rounds. It has happened five times in that time span of 18 seasons.

To some extent it is understandable that a view of Rangers v Celtic finals “all the time” proliferates outside of Scotland. Come to think of it is a view that is hardly unknown north of the border.

For decades there has been the urban legend of the powers that be placing either hot or cold balls in the velvet bag to differentiate the Old Firm from the other clubs in order to keep them separate. Of course the fact that it has “failed” five times isn’t necessarily prove that it hasn’t been tried.

After all we are talking about the Scottish Football Association, an organization that would have trouble arranging a piss up in a brewery.

But back to the point in question. The XFM comment was obviously intended to convey a message that the Old Firm dominates the Scottish Cup. It raises the question (a) is it true and (b) is the domination greater or less than in England.

In terms of winning the Scottish Cup the record book is proof positive. The Scottish Cup has been played for 124 times, Celtic have won 34 times, Rangers 33 times and the only other club in double figures is Queen’s Park with ten. But Queen’s Park the last win was in 1893 and their last appearance in the final was 1900. Of current SPL teams Hearts and Aberdeen have each lifted the cup 7 times.

When you narrow the range to the last 18 seasons (since the advent of the Premier League in England) the domination of the trophy becomes even more pronounced from a success rate of 54% to 72%. Only five Scottish teams other than Rangers and Celtic have won the Cup since 1993 – Hearts and Dundee United twice and Kilmarnock.

So although the actual comment of usually meeting in the final is incorrect it is hard to argue anything other than the Old Firm dominates the Scottish Cup and in fact that domination is on the rise.

That leads us to the second part of the question and that is how does Old Firm domination compare with the reality of English football? Some allowances have to be for England been geographically larger with around 10 times the population and almost two and a half times the number of professional clubs.

The FA Cup has been played for 129 times and Manchester United have won it more times than any other side – 11. Then if we look at the other members of what has become known as the big four (a reasonable expansion given the greater size of the English game) Arsenal have won 10, Liverpool 7 and Chelsea 6. With only 26% of the wins between them it hardly qualifies as dominion over the tournament from inception.

However, when the time frame is narrowed to 18 seasons (the birth of the Premier League) the picture becomes a very different one. The big four have won sixteen of the last 18 FA Cup Finals with only Everton and Portsmouth breaking their cartel. In percentage terms that is 88%.

Seems in terms of a relatively small number of clubs dominating the major cup competition England now have more to be concerned about than their neighbours north of the border.

One response to “Rangers and Celtic Envious of FA Cup Domination?”

  1. Ursusarctos says:

    OK, Bobby, taking your point that cup winners in the Sky era are even more concentrated, in relative terms, in England than Scotland …

    And given that the Old Firm have dominated the SPL standings (and financial tables) since its founding at least as much, if not more, than the Big Four have the EPL in the same period (agreed, or not?) …

    Then what explains the relative under-performance of the Old Firm in the Scottish Cup, compared to the Big Four in the FA Cup?


    (As an aside, I loath the term “Big Four” … it reifies a temporary, accidental era in English football history into something seemingly inevitable and set-in-stone. Pre EPL, where was Chelsea as compared to Everton? If not for RA buying the club, would we not likely have a “Big Three”, with CFC as a good contender for a rotating “best of the rest”? Given its (lack of) results in the ’90s, did LFC really deserve to be considered part of any English football elite, no matter the fan base or relative financial muscle? With City and (perhaps) Spurs, do we now have a “Big Five” – and if FSG works the equivalent magic at Anfield that it did at Fenway, will that become a “Big Six”? The concept starts to lose all meaning … (and what happens if a new UEFA coefficient meant the EPL were to only get three CL places …?)


Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

House Rules

Please refrain from posting comments that;

  • Attempt to demean, intimidate or bully fellow readers
  • Are racist, sexist, homophobic, sexually explicit, intolerant or otherwise abusive
  • Includes language likely to offend or attempts to try and circumvent this request
  • Could be considered spam

The House reserves the right to delete any such comments and to block further participation on the site.

Soccer Report Extra
© copyright 2010. All rights reserved.
Designed and Developed by:
Bills'eye + Underscorefunk Design